Rinse. Repeat. Indeed.

Atrios is himself sagacious.

...let me just add what the real point is. Let's assume that Biden is right - do what he says, and things will improve. The corollary to that is if we don't do what he says, things won't improve. The probability of the Bush administration taking advice from Joe Biden is about 0. So what Joe Biden should understand is that lots more American soldiers are going to die while he sits around and waits for Bush to take his calls. And, then, a year from now he can give the damn speech again, perhaps with an "I really mean it this time" tacked on. Rinse, repeat.

That's why Rep. Murtha's speech was so powerful, and so well able to provoke the nasty whiplash from preznit all the way down to the Mexican Rat Dog.

If the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result each time, then those Democrats and Republicans who keep wringing their hands and declaring "Yes, the Cheney administration is bungling it, but we must not abandon the mission in Iraq; they should just start doing it my way," are batshit nuts. They've been saying that since February 2003, and the bungling -- and the dying -- goes on.

Murtha's speech pulled the cover off of that. He basically said that our occupation isn't working, quite the opposite. Our presence there fuels the insurgency and the insurgency will be the fuel that sets off a civil war (assuming one isn't already in full swing). And we don't want to find our troops acting as lineskeepers of a civil war.

On a related note, I love the administration's talking points in response to Murtha's speech and calls for investigating the manipulation of pre-war intelligence: Free speech is fine. As long as it's not too free.

Cheney said in his speech today that he does not believe it is "wrong to criticize the war on terror or any aspect thereof" and that he enjoys "energetic debate on issues facing our country." He called Murtha "a good man, a Marine, a patriot" and said that while he disagreed with him, the congressman was "taking a clear stand in an entirely legitimate discussion."

However, Cheney said: "What is not legitimate and what I will again say is dishonest and reprehensible is the suggestion by some U.S. senators that the president of the United States or any member of his administration purposely misled the American people on prewar intelligence. Some of the most irresponsible comments have come from politicians who actually voted in favor of authorizing the use of force against Saddam Hussein. These are elected officials who had access to the intelligence materials. They are known to have a high opinion of their own analytical capabilities. And they were free to reach their own judgments based upon the evidence."

[...]

"One might also argue that untruthful charges against the commander in chief have an insidious effect on the war effort itself," Cheney said. "I'm unwilling to say that only because I know the character of the United States armed forces."

One might say that, eh? Hmmm.